It took me a long time (coming back to it quite a few times over the past two months) but WOW...you've articulated so many things I've been thinking about on the periphery but didn't have words before.
I only found out about the word "tradwife" a few months ago but then it seemed...everywhere? I've always felt very uncomfortable with social media 'influencers' because the reels are *not real*.
Thank you for your time and energy spent - well worth it.
Wow. I thought it was a kink! 🤣 I started calling myself a trad wife to have a little fun but I get your point. Washington State is full of empowered and loose homeschoolers so I don’t really feel the need to distinguish myself from the boogie men. I do like finding allegiance where I can. We all deserve more nuance than a right and left. My neighbor is a lot more important to me than a political candidate and I’ll focus on being who I am in my own community.
Oh my gosh! Mind blown! I’ve been homeschooling 8 years and have become incredibly frustrated and disillusioned with it. One child has returned to school for a year or 2 by their choice (senior years) which I could write a book about but we’ve been lucky it has gone well. Still boxing on with the second child but in such 2 minds about what is right there for all of us. I’ve met so many incredible people who I love and value through homeschooling . But also the problems within the community are beyond words sometimes. Thank you so much for this article!
I became particularly…..confused, flummoxed, concerned…..the more I looked into Gatto and Holt and realised Gatto in particular became incredibly libertarian/right wing etc (I don’t know exactly how his views would be described in today’s political landscape but they certainly started to raise red flags for this lefty humanitarian). I also wanted to ask both of them, and homeschoolers in general, why is it always women who are doing the wrong thing - women who are trying to homeschool are now told they are doing it wrong, and have to give their children absolute freedom, but also carry the responsibility 100% if their children appear to be spoilt, unkempt, disillusioned, lacking motivation etc. (I’m not saying they all will appear that way, or even that those things are necessarily bad, but just that women/mothers can’t really get it right no matter what - if you put any limits in you are ruining them, if you let them run wild and they don’t magically find inherent motivation to start up their own business and ‘carve their own path’ then you have also ruined them).
I have gone from trying to embrace unschooling to just muddling along with eclectic homeschooling to fit the needs of each child. And along the way covid has polarised the community further, which has led to further division in the homeschooling community as the differences between various groups became too polarised to co-exist quietly.
There is just so much privilege in homeschooling which goes unacknowledged. The blogs about unschooling are rampant with it. The exact kind of BS you point out with trad wives online - problems with socialising - just post where you will be, jump in the car and hang out at the beach all day and ‘find your tribe’ say the women in Australia with a pleasant enough year round climate, in a big enough city to have other likeminded people and income for a car and petrol. 😵💫. Problems with kids on devices - same answer! “I never limit them, I just ensure we have plenty of other activities as well”….ie I limit them by stealth! They don’t address what happens if wee Tarquin or Rupert won’t get in the car to go to the activities, or there is no money for the petrol, or no nearby fun beach with fun friends. Look over there at my refreshed art station! 😂.
Anyway, I digress. Thanks again for the unlocked article - I really want to support your writing and will try to find money for it in next months budget! But I *so* appreciate your mahi (work) to write this and I’m going to share it extensively (privately, will probably get kicked out of homeschooling groups if I post something they will all call ‘divisive’).
Stephanie thanks for your heartfelt, passionate response. I feel all of it soooo deeply. There are so many issues we skirt over all the time in favour of the same platitudes. Thank you for reading!!
I haven’t said much on here (maybe a cutie post?) but Virginia Sole-smith wrote a long essay on it a while back, let me know if you can’t find it I’ll try to search.
Thank you, Fran, for letting me read your entire essay for free. Please don't take it personally when I tell you that I have a few too many political disagreements with it to hit the like button.
For what it's worth, I've just made an effort to persuade one of my fellow libertarians, "El Gato Malo", to embrace youth rights:
I figured you would Brian hahaha. Not personal at all. I don't expect everyone or even most people to agree with me - but I do appreciate you took the time to read it.
Having grown up in the evangelical church and far right arena, thank you for this article. It’s definitely hard to be associated with that world, although I think unschoolers are a little outside of it. Hey, if HSLDA won’t represent you, maybe you’re doing something right? 😉
I was raised to think stay at home motherhood was the best. Ironically, my mother worked full time since I was school age, but all the literature I consumed from evangelicals told me staying home with your kids was the best - next to being a missionary, of course (and submit to your husband!). It never occurred to me that maybe one day I would need a career or other source of income until I read The Feminine Mistake. So while right now I’m a bit burned out, I’m treading water with my work and keeping it alive, and I would advocate for every mom to have some kind of work, or a solid plan for how she might get back to work when she wants to.
Not sure where I’m going with this other than yes, to me trad wives are dangerous (remind me of handmaids tale 😬). I feel like I barely made it out. Let’s reclaim homeschooling and unschooling from the far right! 🙌🏻
A libertarian anti-vaxer, who’s mistaken personal preferences for “freedom”
A a traditional Christian values homeschool family who teaches “religious science”
A homeschool influencer of various flavors, trad-wife being one.
AND us… the hard left leaning, rights of the child, social justice minded, approaching the journey as an opportunity for the familial (r)evolution … we need a hashtaggable short-hand.
We totally DO! Silence can look like alliance and it’s important, as you said, that what we stand for is apparent. And yes, we are all doing really well, just doing it irl. Warm hugs from S.F.
A thoughtful post, Fran. Absent the terminology and, of course, social media, this is an old discussion. Back in 1979 or '80, I asked John Holt for advice about this very thing: my concern that as a progressive home educator believing in children's rights and being interviewed by the media, I found myself seeming to promote things I didn't believe in (i.e. patriarchy, religion, etc). He told me not to worry, that we're all under the same, big umbrella. I have to wonder what his answer would be today if he were alive. Part of my personal solution ended up being not using any descriptor that used the word "school."
Wendy that is fascinating!! And amazing you could bring it up to him. Perhaps the answer made sense then, not sure it’s still valid now though! I can totally see why it makes sense to seek the things that unite us.. but often unity ends up looking like complicity with things we are morally not okay with. Interesting though that this is an old convo that you and others have had before.
John and I were colleagues in the early days of kickstarting what he called the “unschooling” community — he in the US and I in Canada. My husband and I were in the early days of publishing our first magazine, Natural Life, and he asked for tips as he prepared to launch his Growing Without Schooling. When people in Canada asked him for help starting to homeschool, he referred them to me, and vice versa. So we also shared ideas and concerns (including mine that the term “unschooling” would come back to haunt). The issue of complicity comes up these days in so many aspects of life, as people stereotype, sort, and label others. (That’s taught in school! ;-)
I appreciate all the research and details you've included! I have been thinking about this topic a lot and hope to write something about eventually. I think about how I would love to see our society value care work and domestic activities and move away from the idea that women have to lean in or do things the way men do in order to gain power and value. And it is interesting to me that in some ways the internet trad wives are promoting care work and domesticity and making money or fame from these pursuits, giving domestic work more value. But of course they do this while also, presumably, supporting systems and ideas that are exclusive and harmful.
As much as I think about all this trad wife stuff, I tend to stay away from actually looking at their accounts and reading your piece also made me realize that I find it hard to believe that women really do submit to men and give up agency. Partially because the trad wives on social media are at least able to run their accounts and probably also because I am in my liberal SAHM bubble.
Yeah I’m not actually sure how many trad wives are actually traditional wives - bc in some ways they perform domesticity while actually girl-bossing (making content, doing promotions, etc etc). It’s so super weird. I don’t love the way they are coming to “own” the conversation around domestic work. I’d love to read your thoughts when you’re ready!!
This was....amazing.
It took me a long time (coming back to it quite a few times over the past two months) but WOW...you've articulated so many things I've been thinking about on the periphery but didn't have words before.
I only found out about the word "tradwife" a few months ago but then it seemed...everywhere? I've always felt very uncomfortable with social media 'influencers' because the reels are *not real*.
Thank you for your time and energy spent - well worth it.
Wow. I thought it was a kink! 🤣 I started calling myself a trad wife to have a little fun but I get your point. Washington State is full of empowered and loose homeschoolers so I don’t really feel the need to distinguish myself from the boogie men. I do like finding allegiance where I can. We all deserve more nuance than a right and left. My neighbor is a lot more important to me than a political candidate and I’ll focus on being who I am in my own community.
Oh my gosh! Mind blown! I’ve been homeschooling 8 years and have become incredibly frustrated and disillusioned with it. One child has returned to school for a year or 2 by their choice (senior years) which I could write a book about but we’ve been lucky it has gone well. Still boxing on with the second child but in such 2 minds about what is right there for all of us. I’ve met so many incredible people who I love and value through homeschooling . But also the problems within the community are beyond words sometimes. Thank you so much for this article!
I became particularly…..confused, flummoxed, concerned…..the more I looked into Gatto and Holt and realised Gatto in particular became incredibly libertarian/right wing etc (I don’t know exactly how his views would be described in today’s political landscape but they certainly started to raise red flags for this lefty humanitarian). I also wanted to ask both of them, and homeschoolers in general, why is it always women who are doing the wrong thing - women who are trying to homeschool are now told they are doing it wrong, and have to give their children absolute freedom, but also carry the responsibility 100% if their children appear to be spoilt, unkempt, disillusioned, lacking motivation etc. (I’m not saying they all will appear that way, or even that those things are necessarily bad, but just that women/mothers can’t really get it right no matter what - if you put any limits in you are ruining them, if you let them run wild and they don’t magically find inherent motivation to start up their own business and ‘carve their own path’ then you have also ruined them).
I have gone from trying to embrace unschooling to just muddling along with eclectic homeschooling to fit the needs of each child. And along the way covid has polarised the community further, which has led to further division in the homeschooling community as the differences between various groups became too polarised to co-exist quietly.
There is just so much privilege in homeschooling which goes unacknowledged. The blogs about unschooling are rampant with it. The exact kind of BS you point out with trad wives online - problems with socialising - just post where you will be, jump in the car and hang out at the beach all day and ‘find your tribe’ say the women in Australia with a pleasant enough year round climate, in a big enough city to have other likeminded people and income for a car and petrol. 😵💫. Problems with kids on devices - same answer! “I never limit them, I just ensure we have plenty of other activities as well”….ie I limit them by stealth! They don’t address what happens if wee Tarquin or Rupert won’t get in the car to go to the activities, or there is no money for the petrol, or no nearby fun beach with fun friends. Look over there at my refreshed art station! 😂.
Anyway, I digress. Thanks again for the unlocked article - I really want to support your writing and will try to find money for it in next months budget! But I *so* appreciate your mahi (work) to write this and I’m going to share it extensively (privately, will probably get kicked out of homeschooling groups if I post something they will all call ‘divisive’).
Stephanie thanks for your heartfelt, passionate response. I feel all of it soooo deeply. There are so many issues we skirt over all the time in favour of the same platitudes. Thank you for reading!!
Hi! Lots of interesting points to think about here!
Can I ask what I’ve missed about your thoughts on 1000 hours outside? :)
I haven’t said much on here (maybe a cutie post?) but Virginia Sole-smith wrote a long essay on it a while back, let me know if you can’t find it I’ll try to search.
Also interested in this! I didn’t do it but know people who did (not sure if it’s still a thing).
Thank you, Fran, for letting me read your entire essay for free. Please don't take it personally when I tell you that I have a few too many political disagreements with it to hit the like button.
For what it's worth, I've just made an effort to persuade one of my fellow libertarians, "El Gato Malo", to embrace youth rights:
https://substack.com/@briandixon420134/note/c-70225620
I figured you would Brian hahaha. Not personal at all. I don't expect everyone or even most people to agree with me - but I do appreciate you took the time to read it.
excellent writing Franny 🤌🏼
Having grown up in the evangelical church and far right arena, thank you for this article. It’s definitely hard to be associated with that world, although I think unschoolers are a little outside of it. Hey, if HSLDA won’t represent you, maybe you’re doing something right? 😉
I was raised to think stay at home motherhood was the best. Ironically, my mother worked full time since I was school age, but all the literature I consumed from evangelicals told me staying home with your kids was the best - next to being a missionary, of course (and submit to your husband!). It never occurred to me that maybe one day I would need a career or other source of income until I read The Feminine Mistake. So while right now I’m a bit burned out, I’m treading water with my work and keeping it alive, and I would advocate for every mom to have some kind of work, or a solid plan for how she might get back to work when she wants to.
Not sure where I’m going with this other than yes, to me trad wives are dangerous (remind me of handmaids tale 😬). I feel like I barely made it out. Let’s reclaim homeschooling and unschooling from the far right! 🙌🏻
Fran! This article..! So well said.
These ideas have been top of mind over here too.
On the homeschool journey you’re sure to meet:
A libertarian anti-vaxer, who’s mistaken personal preferences for “freedom”
A a traditional Christian values homeschool family who teaches “religious science”
A homeschool influencer of various flavors, trad-wife being one.
AND us… the hard left leaning, rights of the child, social justice minded, approaching the journey as an opportunity for the familial (r)evolution … we need a hashtaggable short-hand.
I really enjoyed this article, Fran. 🖤
We DO need a hashtaggable short-hand!! I hope you're well Heather, and thanks for reading :)
We totally DO! Silence can look like alliance and it’s important, as you said, that what we stand for is apparent. And yes, we are all doing really well, just doing it irl. Warm hugs from S.F.
A thoughtful post, Fran. Absent the terminology and, of course, social media, this is an old discussion. Back in 1979 or '80, I asked John Holt for advice about this very thing: my concern that as a progressive home educator believing in children's rights and being interviewed by the media, I found myself seeming to promote things I didn't believe in (i.e. patriarchy, religion, etc). He told me not to worry, that we're all under the same, big umbrella. I have to wonder what his answer would be today if he were alive. Part of my personal solution ended up being not using any descriptor that used the word "school."
Wendy that is fascinating!! And amazing you could bring it up to him. Perhaps the answer made sense then, not sure it’s still valid now though! I can totally see why it makes sense to seek the things that unite us.. but often unity ends up looking like complicity with things we are morally not okay with. Interesting though that this is an old convo that you and others have had before.
John and I were colleagues in the early days of kickstarting what he called the “unschooling” community — he in the US and I in Canada. My husband and I were in the early days of publishing our first magazine, Natural Life, and he asked for tips as he prepared to launch his Growing Without Schooling. When people in Canada asked him for help starting to homeschool, he referred them to me, and vice versa. So we also shared ideas and concerns (including mine that the term “unschooling” would come back to haunt). The issue of complicity comes up these days in so many aspects of life, as people stereotype, sort, and label others. (That’s taught in school! ;-)
I appreciate all the research and details you've included! I have been thinking about this topic a lot and hope to write something about eventually. I think about how I would love to see our society value care work and domestic activities and move away from the idea that women have to lean in or do things the way men do in order to gain power and value. And it is interesting to me that in some ways the internet trad wives are promoting care work and domesticity and making money or fame from these pursuits, giving domestic work more value. But of course they do this while also, presumably, supporting systems and ideas that are exclusive and harmful.
As much as I think about all this trad wife stuff, I tend to stay away from actually looking at their accounts and reading your piece also made me realize that I find it hard to believe that women really do submit to men and give up agency. Partially because the trad wives on social media are at least able to run their accounts and probably also because I am in my liberal SAHM bubble.
Yeah I’m not actually sure how many trad wives are actually traditional wives - bc in some ways they perform domesticity while actually girl-bossing (making content, doing promotions, etc etc). It’s so super weird. I don’t love the way they are coming to “own” the conversation around domestic work. I’d love to read your thoughts when you’re ready!!